Fliess 3 - "Einmal DirectDrive - Immer DirectDrive!"

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Hey guys!

First of all there are good news about VESC project - http://www.electric-skateboard.builders/t/vesc-project-com-is-online-public-vesc-tool-download/32268. I think everybody is gonna test new firmware now :slight_smile: I am personally 100% happy with 2.18 and don’t want to fuck anything up now at the night, when I am still super excited about 30km crazy ride on my Fliess 3. Emotions may change over the night, so I have to drop some messages/photos here until inspiration is gone.

The main message is simple - abandon your belt driven builds and just try direct drive! Believe me, you will never look back. I will not start reasoning here why, because it “all depends…”, it’s “all subjective…”, etc. I personally got much smoother ride, more reliable (read simple) system, amazing brakes! (up to dragging) and I didn’t lose in performance. And Fliess doesn’t compromise the performance if you remember from https://www.electric-skateboard.builders/t/fliess-65kmh/22413. It’s all about having fun and fun gets limited if performance is limited :slight_smile:

In my previous topic I promised to try direct drive, so here we go. I am still under “riding drugs” and may write some very subjective bullshit, so just ignore. I need to ride few more hundreds to realize that there is still something to improve and that Fliess 3 is not yet the best in the world haha

just a nice photo with “old shitty belts drivetrain” :wink:

got some stuff for direct drive experiments…naive dreamer

even more naively spent few hours to fuck up the truck

and stator

good enough for experiments mounting system

only later realized, that the only solid solution would be to make a truck myself

small sk3 could even drive me on flats

time to heat it up to >100 by Celsius to know the limits of bearings, magnets, etc.

as I said, enough for testing

one more naive (even stupid!) idea to fight at least somehow against overheating :slight_smile:

much cooler with 2 motors

night ride with burnouts haha

and of course testing on dusty/rocky roads, because they are not avoidable without limiting your freedom

poor Kegels

even mounted cooling fans on my dual vesc, due to inefficiency working in pair with high KV motors

already properly protected motor

and again testing, but this time with softer and bigger FlyWheels

got a nail :open_mouth:

my beasty life time consumers

nothing should bend with 12mm hardened axle

technical part is finally over and exceeds my expectations

now it’s time to make Fliess 3 also nicer. It’s gonna be lower with drop down deck + nicer enclosure (Kydex) + nicer motor wires. I don’t actually know what to wish more… Any ideas guys? I will give it to anybody here in Frankfurt to test just to get some feedbacks, because I simply love riding this beast and I want to know how it is in comparison. To be continued

p.s. and remember - abandon your belt driven builds and just try direct drive! Believe me, you will never look back.

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Artist bro!!!

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home made carvons, nice

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Still think belt drives are here to stay for hill climbing and hi-power usage, hub/direct drive motors will have problems with cooling for quite some time. Oh and these look nicer than carvons, so congrats :wink:

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I feel like you would be the hybrid result if Benjamin and Jerry from Carvon had a long lost son…

Fist you make your own dual VESC, then you make your direct drives… seriously tho, who are you?? You definitely have some next level skills tho, mad props!

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I also find it fascinating how you work your on your projects in the shadows and then you come back, make a thread and blast our faces with a ton of fascinating pictures, build progress, information etc…i find it extremely motivating to go and do some crazy sh*t to my build. You rock :metal:!

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Hey it’s me, your son!

For real though this is amazing. I love it, I’m amazed at your level of ability honestly. They looks so fun to ride aswell! Hopefully we might be able to get a production product/DIY guide for people who want to make direct drives?

Thanks :slight_smile:

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Well done, this is very inspiring to get back on my first project (make a hub motor like in the endless sphere)and now this… Do you sell those wheel attachments to motor? Those are my problem in my abandoned hub project,… This is really awesome board…

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Hi @fliess you dropped a new bomb ! Love it !

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Woah that’s some next level craftsmanship right there. Looks really slick man!

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should get some custom wind motors and sell a motor-motor-mounts-truck package dude… even as a beta people will get on board

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sieht mega geil aus! dreieck zu stern schon gemacht?:stuck_out_tongue:

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Wow, its beutiful dude Are you still living in Frankfurt? I realy want to ride it lol

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Any ideas guys? I will give it to anybody here in Frankfurt to test just to get some feedbacks, because I simply love riding this beast and I want to know how it is in comparison. To be continued

I have some good news for you my friend :smiley:

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Wow! Didn’t expect to get so many nice comments, guys. I really appreciate this! It’s what makes me thinking that I am not just wasting my time. Actually I never thought so :wink:

Seriously talking, of course I admit that my ideas are not new ideas, and what I did is just implementation. But if I got it implemented, then anybody else can do it. So I hope my post encourages.

Now, thinking about time/effort/money spent, I would maybe rather buy some ready solution. There is only one BUT - there is nothing on the market what meets my requirements exactly and you are always dependent on 3rd party if something breaks. Worst feeling ever to be afraid to fuck something up while riding :worried: You just wanna let it go, whatever conditions are…something breaks and you can just replace it to be back on the road next days. Luckily, electric skateboard is something relatively simple to build. I don’t want to build my own car :smile: Understand me correctly. I hope it’s not my stupid philosophy and most people build themselves just to get something better than what is available on the market and to be sure your board is ready to fly any time.

@Rinzler, I was also sure that belt driven systems win, until tried direct drive. You have to live in really hilly area to be worried about overheating motors. Assuming we are talking about street longboards with 83-90mm wheels. I would rather put now a 3rd motor, than come back to belts :smiley:

@JLabs, put hundreds of hours on something and you have “next level skills” bro. Simple :wink:

@Armin, hey my son, all is on pictures, isn’t it? :slight_smile:

@PartyPoison, these wheel attachments costed me few evenings of my life! Don’t touch them! )) Seriously, they are nothing without other parts man, and it’s all hand made without even drawings.

@Vanarian, remember our long discussions on endless-sphere. I hope you’ve got what you wanted!

@Cobber, until now only you shown the interest. If you buy 100x from me, then I already go to my cave to drill and blast! :smile:

@Nordle, one is rewound and another just switched :wink: Rewound performs a bit better though.

@Factory72, @Armin, I really want it to be ridden by somebody who knows how to ride electric beasts! I am in Riedberg area. Come here guys, we have plenty of police-free roads through the fields.

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@fliess Nice to find you again! Yes I got even more than what I wanted, still experimenting but I got my hands on caloducs, heats sinks, waiting for a killer thermal paste to be shipped tomorrow for further experiments! Even got to try Peltiers haha

Hubs are waiting to be tested, I finished assembly today and it fits tight. I’ll re-open them to try what we discussed back then with the exhausts!

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Put a few more miles on them bro, might be hard up to get a buyer for 100x but I’m sure there would be people who would buy a carvon v3/4 clone set for a diy build as long as there is no fundamental breech of business practice with carvon (& the $$$ was good)? and I don’t see any…

Either way, love to see some video. What motor kv are you using? I guess the next step is a custom diy motor wind or go to someone like APS?

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Winter is coming :smile: Gonna put few more hundreds for sure before winter. Only going to the office and back is 20km with jumps over the curbstones every 200m. Evolve managed to withstand this conditions exactly 200km until the motor fell apart :smile: I am very thankful to Evolve, because it was a strong trigger to build something more reliable. In regards to motors man, believe me I had enough fun rewinding them over and over to get exactly what I wanted. On Fliess 3 one is rewound to ~100kv and another just switched from 149kv delta to ~0,7x149kv star. Usually I weight the stator before and after rewinding. +10-30g to the initial weight is a good result :relaxed: Video for sure, just got today my Yi 4k+.

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I always learn from you some new words, like caloducs or peltiers. Gonna check now what does it all mean :smile:

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Haha caloducs are a type of copper heatpipe (sorry I think it is a french word) and Peltier are cold /hot pump flat modules ; kinda like an active cooler. It runs highly inefficient and pumps some watts but it is able to cool temp down to negative celsius when optimally set. No passive cooling can do that.

So I want to try just for fun. The problem is not power drawn from batteries since we use huge ones. It is more about heat disispation, since it really starts being annoying past 3 degrees under ambient temp. There is room for progression though, I’ll keep experimenting ! But all my heatpipes and stuff are already way overkill for VESC. It is not temp anymore but components themselves which will limit power.