REVIEW and EU/USA GROUP BUY - 90mm MAD Hub motors 75Kv or 130Kv - Dual 170 Euro. 1st round Closed_ Working on the DD conversion Kit_Mad Fury

REVIEW Hello folk! As promise I would like to share my thought about these hubs, that from now on I called MAD hubs, because it is what I thought when I ride them for the first time and to make it easier recalled them. Plus a comparison with the known ones from DIYEboard (Meepo style) http://www.diyeboard.com/dual-hub-motor-9052mm-1000w75kv-power-truck-front-truck-kit-p-558.html. The MAD hubs come in two version 75Kv and 130Kv, rated at 1800w peak current and 500w continuous. You may notice that they look like the one Torque Board was selling and indeed they have the same specs too, but I want to specify that they do not come from them. That’s also the reason why I wanted to first test them before close the GB. For the test I got the 130Kv ones, mainly because my plan was to find new hub motors to replace the DIYEboard ones, which are great, but I got used of the top speed and I wanted something more! As board I used a spud build (https://www.electric-skateboard.builders/t/first-build-the-avenger-jet-spud-dual-hubs-motors-custom-10s3p-30q-maytech-vescs/52437?page=3) having a 10s3p Samsung 30Q battery and 2 Maytech’s VESCs. I first wanted to describe the 130Kv hub motors itself. They came assembled, without the truck. On the website they advice to use Paris style trucks since you need rounded hanger ends, but if you are willing to modify other trucks, such as caliber, they will work too. For the test I bought Paris clone truck from Ali (I will post my thoughts about them later one). Here you can find some pics of the disassembled motor.

IMG_20180811_143446IMG_20180811_143359IMG_20180811_141155IMG_20180811_143633IMG_20180811_131739IMG_20180811_131851IMG_20180811_131902IMG_20180811_131910 hub6

The motor size is comparable with a 6355 outrunner motor and overall looks good. I am not an expert in judging windings, but it seems legit. Looking at the motor itself I first didn’t like some design choices. The motor can is kept together with long screws that are attached only at the end. The motors mount on the truck with a collar that slides on the end of hanger and uses two screws to secure the motors in place. Last thing the PU used is a 90mm 90A which I thought would be too hard. For the installation I follow the tips given on the forum https://www.electric-skateboard.builders/t/tips-on-installing-torque-boards-dual-hub-motors/29586/6?u=rey8801, but I will also post later on a step by step “how to do it tutorial”, with pictures for better understanding. For the comparison I chose to post the telemetry data from both the two hubs (130Kv MAD hubs Vs 75Kv DIYEboard) recorded on the same trip. For better comparison I used the same board and settings for both, the only differences were the motors and that the MAD hubs run sensored.

Results from telemetry and review:

DIYEboard 75Kv (65Kv real)

DIYEboard vescmonitor

MAD 130Kv (110Kv real) Hubs

vescmonitor MAD%20130Kv%20telemtry

Overall results 130Kv MAD hubs Vs 75Kv DIYEboard

Pro:

  • Coasting capability. The MAD hubs surprised me for the free wheels experience. Don’t get me wrong also the other hubs roll well, but these ones do it better. Basically you can accelerate and then coast for longer than the other. Same thing if you push them as normal skateboard, I would say you feel 1/3 of the resistance compare the others. Really like this aspect.

  • Ride smoothness. One of the aspect that I judged as a problem at the begging was the 90A PU used. It actually turned out be way better than the other hubs with softer PU (I think 80A). Probably because the MAD hubs have 15mm PU thickness. Anyhow what matter is that I feel way less the bad roads. If I need to rate the difference I would say 3 times better compare to the other hubs (they are not famous for ride smoothness ). Of course full urethane will always be better in absorbing vibrations, but I can really live with that with these hubs.

  • Power output. Both from riding feelings and telemetry data the MAD hubs are more powerful than the others. They easy output 1800watt (total from 2 hubs) compare to 1200-1300 watt of the DIYEboard hubs on hard acceleration. Although I could reach up to 1600watt few times on hard acceleration up hills. Of course the two hubs have different Kv, so would have been better to use the same Kv for both the motors. Anyhow overall the DIYEboard wins over the MAD 130Kv hubs for the takeoff up to let’s say 10-15kmh (this DIYEboard 75Kv surprise everyone for the instant torque). So let say in a drag race, after the first 15 meters there is no chance anymore for the DIYEboard ones, really no game. Don’t get me wrong the MAD hubs pull too, it’s just that the motors are let say less efficient at really low rpm compare to 75Kv hubs. If you want instant torque, for an overall lower speed I am sure the MAD 75Kv version will be a blast. I would be really curious to try them out! Nevertheless I could climb all the hills in my city with no problem at all (more about hill climbing here https://www.electric-skateboard.builders/t/eu-usa-group-buy-90mm-dual-hub-motors-75kv-or-130kv-dual-170-euro-3-to-go/62002/113?u=rey8801).

  • Top speed. What to say…they fly, that’s it. Fun fact, to understand how much they can pull is that I never reach 95% of duty with these motors. Before I used to pull the throttle all the way up and you see from the telemetry the duty at 95% and then the motors amp, speed ecc increasing over time. With these motors I can reach at most 70-80% afterward my VESC setting limits the power. When you ride you do not feel it at all, but basically I easy reach all the battery and motor max limits. With that being said +50kmh easy, too easy maybe. Probably a bigger LiIon battery (10s4p or above, 12s…) or Lipo are better if you want release all the power. I think it’s already plenty though :rofl:.

Cons:

  • VESC temperature. This is actually the only issue I have experienced with them compare to the DIYEboard hubs. I guess is due to the difference in power and current drain. Of course depends how you ride, but if I do it hard the VESC temperature rises fast on my Maytech’s VESC. This can be solved limiting the max motor and battery settings. Basically to reduce the peak currents, but still keep nice top speed.

vescmonitor

A real heatsink , better VESC, or 12s will probably help too. Don’t get me wrong I use it every day, I don’t ride all the time at plus 50kmh :smile:. With 30Kmh average and some sprints not problem.

  • Battery drain. Same story, they ask more, if you push hard they drain more. Not surprise by that. Again if you ride in a more enjoyable way, same range of the others.

Conclusions: I really like the MAD hubs and I am happy with them. I will definitely choose them over the DIYEboard ones. Which versions to choose? Good question, I guess if you plan to climb hills all the time the 75Kv is recommended. Unfortunately I couldn’t test it, but I guess they are the same motors, maybe even the only different between them is the delta and wye configuration, so you can always switch between them (130Kv / 1.73 = 75Kv). On the other hand if you want to have a freaking top speed and overall great power, than go for the 130Kv version, as I did. Of course, keep in mind the max ERPM limit of the 4.12 VESC. With a 130Kv you are at the limit with a 10s, out with a 12s. You can always limit the max ERPM in the VESC setting and moreover the only problem is during bench test, otherwise you need to go over 70kmh to encounter this problem! To make it short, don’t spin it fast on bench .:laughing:

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Hi guys. The review is out check it out! I would like to close the group buy this week, so I would ask everyone who already signed to confirm or not your wishes . Of course you can remove your name from the list, but please let me know otherwise we wait forever :wink: For the ones that wants to join please fill or refill the new form below. After the GB ends I will ask a first transfer to buy the motors only, and then a second one for the shipping costs and additional optional work on the motors since this part is more subjective.

Here the new Google form where I only need your username / How many and which Kv for the motors / the spare PU you want.

lockeboss 2 x 130Kv Zentaria 1 x 130Kv Olli 2 x stormboard1 2 x adamm 2 x 130Kv linsus 1 x 75Kv markyoe 2 x 130Kv Andy87 2 x 130Kv

Confirmed: @lockeboss 2 x 130Kv / 2 spare PU @Andy87 2 x 130Kv / 2 spare PU @LukePL 2 x 75Kv @Aceofspace11 2 x 75Kv @visnu777 2 x 75Kv / 2 spare PU @linsus 2 x 75Kv / 2 spare PU @BigZu 2 x 75Kv / 2 spare PU @mackann 2 x 75Kv / 2 spare PU @Winfly 2 x 130Kv / 2 spare PU

Yeah… thx Ray :wink:

Red this topic last night all drooling about the 130kV hubs that Rey has been shredding hard lately, felt kinda conflicted with my still-coming 35kph board and those 50kph speeds here but then I recalled I had an experiemntal idea to, well to cast my own normal wheels anyway, but had an experiemantal idea to take a mould from similar but bigger 115mm or so offroad/smooth RC car wheels instead with what extra size I could get the same speeds, but would the torque curve be similiar for 65kV’s like Ray described the 130s to be? I mean they probably have same much copper beef, same price range and also same many poles, they (Maytech) have 65kV and 130kV hubs Both available. Anyhow, just a night itch, a showerthought that maybe we 65kV fellas could get best of both worlds, so do speak, altho with hideous big wheels. tho they roll better over stuff<:P

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If you are going to make bigger wheels for sure stay in the range 75Kv range is better. You will gain speed but still having nice torque. Of course the torque is gonna decrease. I couldn’t try these hub motors is 75Kv configuration. I contacted people that used it in 10s and 12s and they say that are really really strong. I believe it since mine are already crazy

Ul-la-laa. definitely gonna do a test ‘drag’ race if because the MADs and Maytechs are same price range and people are just Moaning over to find out what’s best in these cheaper kind of brands. Oh hey jajaa: If I get my board ready I’ll do the very same screen layover test ride, and we can compare, I think

That would be awesome. I am waiting for the other guys to confirm and I will close the group buy. I hope it’s gonna make it. I know that most of the people don’t care too much about hub motors, but if you like the stealth look and sound is a problem for you (catching attention from Police) then hub are perfect. I tried belt drive system and these how I called Mad hubs really go strong really strong. They are in the same price range of Maytech because come from the factory. The real retail price was double

so they come ready fit to the board? iv a 10s4p 30q battery which would you go for 75 or 130kv? and how much in total ?

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Hi! They come hubs only. Then you need to fit them on the truck. I will post a how to do guide, with pics, but basically you need Paris style truck or other truck and you modify the hanger end. You make two drills and screw them on. For the Kv version depends what you want. I tested 130Kv (110Kv in reality) with 10s3p. I found my battery be the limit of my setup because I couldn’t use the whole power of the hubs before hit the limits set in the VESC tool. You don’t feel when riding but I could go 80-85% max duty, with a 10s4p they will be even stronger which is crazy since they already have plenty of power. To make it short of you want super torque go with the 75Kv version, I couldn’t test it, but people that did it said that is super powerful. You will have top speed around 40kmh, I guess. If you want more speed, you will lose a bit of torque but gain a lot of speed with the 130Kv version. As I wrote in the review, I compared them with the DIYeboard hubs 75Kv and the lower Kv wins a only in the first 10kmh when you start from stand still, after that no game. Other aspect that is worth it to mention is the low free wheel resistance, really pleasant to push and the thicker PU that absorbs way better vibration than the other hubs. That’s a summary. More in the review.

Total is 170Euro at my place (custom ecc included). Then depends where you live is 20-30 euro shipping or come and pick it up. You can also suggest another shipping method, no problem :grin:

cool to have a comparison of both of these motors! Could you do some side by side pics of the stators, cans and magnets of both? Then there should be an easy explanation why the MAD Hub is stronger :wink:

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YEh that was the plan from the beginning, a direct comparison from a more known hub and these ones being too expensive to give them a try. The only missing part is to try the 75Kv version with the same setup, which I believe moves the whole power towards lower erpm, so it should be really fun. For that I only have feedback from people that used in 10s and 12s. I do not about the top speed, I guess it is what we aspect from a 75Kv motor, but they told me that the torque is really really strong. Unfortunately no telemetry available :sweat_smile:. Concerning the pictures, I already posted the one for the MAD hubs, now the only motors I have are on my board and with loctite, so I am not planning to open it any soon. If the GB will happen, I can maybe do it later, with the permission of the owner of course. Anyhow the stator size is comparable to a 6355 motor, while if you check an open Meepo hub it looks smaller, for sure shorter than this one. The design of the motor can takes more space https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5sZe1fZkIm8&t=207sDIYEboard%20Hub. If I have the chance I will open the DIYEboard hub.

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I already got a set of these directly from factory, shame because I would totally join in the GB otherwise.

Got 130KV and my first impressions are the similar as yours @rey8801.

What I’ve noticed while taking them apart its that he outside screws holding the PU are M4x12mm and you can very easily over tighten them so that they will touch the stator and potentially make pretty huge mess there. So be careful. I’ve replaced them with 10mm length.

Also, it was incredibly hard to put everything back in together, but maybe I was doing something wrong :slight_smile:

Mine came without any threadlocker anywhere as well. Did you put any on those outside screws? I haven’t yet, kind of worried that it doesn’t leak inside the motor…

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Nice to hear some else has them. Yes I noticed that front screw can almost touch the stator when I was checking the motor can alone. I just paid attention to don’t screw them to much. I applied thread locker in any screws. They come without. Actually better so you inspect the motor. Yes put back the motor is a pain due to the magnets but I have already done in the past so I knew it. For the front screw just apply loctite on the side and screw them horizontally and let them dry upside down so you will be good :wink: one question, which configuration are you using them? Did you also notice a higher battery consumption?

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I actually did over tighten them and everything was looking fine until I mounted and secured the motor on the axle which made the motor block. I’ve noticed it right away fortunately and replaced the screws with 10mm ones, like I said just to feel safer.

Haha, I also had the same idea of mounting the screws while the motor is upside down and will probably do it that way and try not to overdose on loctite.

Just testing the motors for now, I’m using 8S LiPo, my standard configuration. But to tell you the truth I haven’t done any metrics just yet. This board for now is a side project as I don’t have much free time and I need to keep it under wraps so my wife wouldn’t kill me knowing I’m building “another one” xD Shhhh!

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ahaahahah I can immagine the situation. Good that you notice immediately of the screws otherwise it would have been a problem. good luck with your multiple builds!

Just a quick comparison of Maytech 65kV 85mm hubs. The stator amination dimesnions are 31x52mm. The magnets are 2mm thick. Nice touch of embedding the Hall sensors into the laminations

DSC_0019DSC_0018

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Good that you open it up. Yeh I didn’t measure the stator, but on the datasheet it say 53*30mm so pretty much the same. Also the magnets distribution seems really similar, although a bit thicker maybe on MAD hub. MAybe I am wrong.

IMG_20180811_141155

Little update, up to now few people confirmed and other joined. We have 5 full sets (10 hubs) confirmed. I will wait few more days and if we do not reach the goal I will ask the company whether they agree to sell as smaller amount and hope that the price doesn’t change too much. Anyhow I will keep you posted! :wink: Still to confirm whether or not (of course there is not problem in not join anymore but please let me know, so we do not wait. Thx :smiley:): @Zentaria @Olli @stormboard1 (Got reply but not confirmation) @adamm @linsus

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Can’t confirm yet but I filled the form. Can anyone compare those 75KV hubs to dual 6355 belt drive?

The stator size is similar. People compare the 6355 dual belt drive to the torque of the diyeboard hubs. Of course then the belt will go fast than those hubs. I think that the MAD hubs will have more torque of the DIYeboard since they deliver more power than the my DIYeboard hubs. Unfortunately there aren’t a lot of reviews out there. Few people contact me and one said that in 12s beat a way more famous hub board :wink: Of course the choice is yours, but if you are afraid that they won’t deliver enough torque, I am sure they will.

I’m sure that it will be more than enough for me. I’m just looking at it from economic site and it seems that those hubs are way cheaper than dual belt drive. So unless you want to go with crazy power this is the way to go. Only the urethane is a last drawback imo.

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