How do you know this? My experience so far with hubs is that you need a lot more amps to achieve the same result as a belt drive system. 80-90 kv is perfect for most people (too slow for me, which is why I think 110-115 kv would be perfect for me), and I would get about the same top speed as your raptor if I used 90mm wheels (with 80-90 kv dual drive that is).
However, I have found that, even with cold motors (at room temperature), I can pull 80 amps burst that turns into about 60 continuous with a 4wd on a hill which was 21% grade, while maintaining a speed about 22 mph. If your motors can plow up a 21% grade hill at 22 mph, I would be very impressedâŚ
Those rspec big boys guys are powerful with, but youâll get the same effect of 1.5 of those motors or maybe less. Still powerful, but I wonder HOW powerful⌠Maybe if you gave us more specs and info?
The other issue is battery sag. How do you deal with sag? When I pull 60 amps con on a 12s4p LG HE2, I sag pretty heavily. And the space cell is smaller, I it would only be worse. This is one of the biggest issues Iâve had, since the best solution is just a larger battery pack, but itâs hard to keep the board thin with a 12s6p, lol.
I Emailed ORANGATANG About 3 months ago, suggesting they should make a (LARGER) Kegal Wheel for their Eskate market and DIYâers,⌠they responded ,âWe have something âHumongousâ coming soonâ !
Yes excactly !,since they allready have a big eskate market,⌠so people who wanted a BIGGER Wheel wouldânt have to buy ABEC 11 90mm , and could buy a bigger Kegal !
You need to engineer hubs that are optimized for esk8 purpose and donât simply convert current to heat instead of thrust. This solves many issues. The next challenge is controlling current, rpm & temperature.
Here is the direct drive motor we have developed. We are calling it the R-SPEC GHOST (death of the motor mount?) We increased the inside bearing to its maximum size to improve durability & longevity, this also alows maximum surface area for the core to dissipate heat. This is a very big motor, its equivlent to dual R-SPEC 6374 motors (but one thatâs on steroids & with sensors) Plus with the NEW VESCX we can easily feed it the power it needs to perform without heat issues.
Canât deny being a little surprised youâre switching to hub motors. You were very critical of them in your videos and in the past.
Will this one replace the original Raptor? And will we see a comparison video between the two?
On the veledrone test. Hummie Hub motor 90Kv 48 sec mostly inside track.
Boosted dual plus 46.15 sec from center line from speed.
Raptor single drive 39.07 sec from centerine from speed.
The Raptor Dual drive should still hold its own against the new Raptor V2 till we see some new video tests. Be interesting to see how the new direct drives will go for all the criterias - top speed, range, reliability. I can see where its going as theres that potential for that other hub pneumatic wheel option with this set up. Well at least if we have longer truck set up to clear board with the bigger wheel.
when the number of pros outweighs the cons the decision is easyâŚ
i wrote this on reddit, itâs sort of the same question:
The biggest problem with hub motors is not really the hub motor itself (itâs super important though)⌠Itâs got a lot to do with all the other systems that need to work with it to make it great. Firstly you need a motor controller that can handle higher current throughput, we now have VESCX. Next, you need bigger batteries & BMS that can handle more current, we now have that. Then you need a custom made hub motor, with precision engineering and innovative cooling systems so you can pump current into them without thermal shut down. We have solved the problems and now we are building it.
No offense Jason, but this seems to be how enertion works. They always have the best technology and when they see a new technology, they bash it until they have time to develop it on their own, then itâs the great new technology. Itâs about keeping the image up that they have the best stuff on the market. Itâs brilliant marketing. But yea, I remember him specifically bashing the carvons I was trying to use with his vescs. He said something to the affect that hes amazed to even see hubs working at all, even for a brief period until both vescs feel apart the second day.
Anyways, Iâm curious to see how these compare vs hummies new hubs. 3x the stator and copper, much bigger magnets, just in a different shape than these.
I just canât wait for 2017⌠Should be a hell of a year @onloop. Chakas free ride deck, your new raptor and motors, hummies new motors, Iâm working on putting together a complete, and a lot moreâŚ
hubs are clearly the future, itâs just a matter of addressing a couple of their issues. with those solved, about the only disadvantage to a belt driven motor is no longer having the ability to adjust gearing - but even that could be figured out. iâd say the pros far outweigh the cons.
and to those in the USA concerned about the legality of these boards with regards to wattage and top speedâŚseriously? iâll take as many watts and mph as i can get, and ride on the roads allllll dayyyy.
love the decision to use a lower cost board with a separate battery enclosure. this obviously lowers the cost of entry, but more importantly, it allows us to use our own boards, which is probably the most frustrating thing when looking at pre-made boards. everyone has their own preferences with board shapes/lengths/materials; you canât please 'em all.
i can definitely see HI5BER getting a lot of business from people wanting a unique shape and wanting to shed some weight at the same time and just moving all the parts onto one of those boards (assuming itâs possible with the way the wires are routed through the trucks).
We have spent thousands of dollars on R&D and many many many months of research & development to make this system, we have also filed a patent for our innovations that relate directly to these developments.
We will also prove our claims using a dyno & we will be documenting the entire journey on youtube. Feel free to tune in and you can see it first hand.
My mission is to build the best esk8 technology, I will never stop innovatingâŚ
Iâm sure you have and I know you want to and are innovating. For that, I respect you. You also market very well. Saying more powerful is clever, as for the reasons you outlined. Again, smart marketing. I personally can give a rats ass about marketing. I just care about the product. I will abuse (within the expected use of the product) everything until breaking point, just to find bugs. I will never sell a product that Iâm not 99% or higher sure will work well.
Talking to hummie about getting molds made, ect. Some molds are 5k+ USD, and getting motors machine is not cheap either. And you can run everything through formulas, but you donât really know for sure how it will perform until you have them build it and you try it. This often means you will need to do multiple iterations to work out bugs and create a solid motor. I respect your journey, and I hope to play a hand in testing stuff. Iâm excited to try a vesc-x and see how it performs compared to a chaka vesc and a chaka vesc with heatsink.
I think it is how most businesses work, for better or worse. Although there are alternative ways (like the one you might be following). Either way, being a savvy business owner is sometimes overlooked by some of the DIY-turned-business crew (thinking the Jacob hub thread disaster). I also think Enertion is learning pretty quickly, which is one of the advantages of the learn by doing approach. The downside being the hits you take when something doesnât quite work the way you expect.
I agree too, 2017 is shaping up to be the year of the eSk8.builders vendors. Next year will have a lot of great options for the DIY scene, and even more blurring between the commercial guys and the guys spinning (increasingly) solid business in here.
This is all the exciting part of such a relatively new field- constant innovation, and evolution in approaches to the problems.
The pics look great- much better colour scheme and a great look all round.
Cool, canât wait to see some comparisons. Will these motors also become available as a component for the DIY people or only as part of the new Raptor?
