You can find suitable donor scooters for under 50 bucks in all states of repair. Best case the scooter battery pack and motor are in working shape. The next step in finding a suitable esc for it. I know Vesc can drive a brushed motor, and I have one laying around. But I was looking around I found this little guy…
Normally these little scooters run any thing from a 250w motor to a 1000w motor, and draw like 30 amps under load? This looks like it could work out well. Maybe a replacement for some of those older eskates you see floating around that use brushed motors. This unite uses the ppw stranded so it will work with the new eskate remotes so those with old boards with wired remotes could upgrade.
There a good chance that I’ll want to upgrade the battery and motor to brush-less down the line. But if my donor scooter is in good shape I’d be happy to run the old system into the ground before upgrading. It’s ultimately going to be a funky “mad max” a dirt-trike board so I’ll like favor torque over speed, and If it’s fun to ride I’ll keep working on it.
What do you think. Is the hobby brushed motor esc linked a good fit for are application? Would I be better off to run the VESC in brushed mode?
So after doing some web searchers just looking for a good frame to base this build on I came across the Trideck. From what I can tell the Trideck can easily fit a scooter or bike hub motor in rear, and has plenty of space for a battery pack if you’re creative. It even has a built in bike style foot brake. I’ve done some searches on the forum but it looks like no one has built a board using this deck yet. Looks like the this would be a good base for a cheap light duty all terrain board. Retail price is like $230.
Running some number, and it looks like if I can find 1000rpm motor this thing will cook with a top speed of 25mph to 35mph. I ordered a trideck on Black Friday and got my deck for $224 with shipping. I’m pretty excited about this build. Think I’ll make it my winter ride.
No. You must run something sicker on this. JohninCR’s hubmonster, MXUS V3 Turbo. Or Edge / Leaf air cooled motor. Or Q205 motor ? With the lean layout it would also do great as a scooter / seated scooter.
That one has a single wheel in the front, and all the turning happens at the rear truck. Thats a pretty bad set up for a three wheel deck. Like how many cars use only their back wheels to turn? None that I can think of. Really that’s a fucking ass backwards build you are showing right there. Did you even watch the posted video the of the trideck? It looks pretty responsive to me.
Just joined here, but I have been looking at the Trideck for a while, thinking of ways to convert it for the specific purpose of (don’t laugh) running my dog. Must have the ability to run on sidewalks and even dirt paths, and I keep coming back to the Trideck as a starting point. I contacted Laurie at L-Faster because she has some pretty cool e-bike and e-scooter conversion kits. I’ll be following this thread!
I ordered one too, and expect delivery tomorrow or Friday. I am leaning towards a hub motor setup, too, but haven’t ruled out a belt drive setup similar to this:
From what research I have done, it seems like skateboards are typically controlled using a 2.4 or similar receiver with a (V)ESC controlling the motor(s) for simple, handheld wireless control, whereas most hub motor applications utilize an ESC/controller in a box with a lot of wiring for a wired throttle/brake, battery indicators and other readouts/displays, usually for ebike-type applications. I want to do a hybrid where there would be a hub motor but with skateboard-like control. I understand that a hub motor draws/uses more power (or amperage or whatever, I have a lot to learn); how would this affect how the motor is controlled?
As I understand the Vesc can handle up to 60amps, and up to 48v but 36v is “safer”. I’m not really sure how to calculate the ERPM for this style of motor but that’s something to be mindful of. From what I can tell these hub motors pull anything from 20amps to 30amps maybe more before over heating. We will need to balance you volts and amps. More amps means more torque, more volts means more speed, and more of any of these mean more heat.This is just a general rule Ive seen around. Check out https://endless-sphere.com its all about ebikes and such, and has a lot of info on hub motors.
The motors I linked to is rated for 500w. Watt=volts × amps. So a motor feed it 36volts at 20amps you get 720w of power. Bike hub motors can take a lot more then rated so you just need to be mindful of the heat.
Thanks so much for the reply. When you’ve warmed up a bit(!), can you expand a bit on the math? The voltage (24, 36, 48, whichever) is determined by the battery; the ESC then sends this voltage to the motor, as regulated by the throttle, correct? Does the ESC also control how many amps the motor sees, or is the amperage draw a function of the motor’s operation? Let’s say, for example, that I am more concerned with torque than top speed. Is it a function of a programmable ESC that I allow the motor to draw more amps and thus give me more torque, or is it the case that a lower voltage battery (let’s say 24v) allows the motor to draw more amps and thus provide more torque? Sorry for the basic questions, but in the research I’ve done it’s almost universal that hub motors are powered by control boxes that also have wired throttle, brake, LCD display etc. as would be typical on an ebike application, whereas skateboards seem to be universally controlled by an RC ESC or dedicated (V)ESC and wireless/radio controller/recieiver. Finally, how are you determining how much power (watts) you need? Are you using a calculator to project weight/speed/climbing ability? Thanks again, hope this isn’t annoying!
Sounds like you need to do some reading. A Vesc and a bike esc are basically the same thing. Just with different features. You can build a ebike with a Vesc, and a board with a bike esc. The Vesc is nice for a board because its wireless.
Now about volts and amps. The more Amps you pull the hotter everything runs. A 24v system will pull more amps and generate more heat then a 36v system doing the same work, and as you go up in voltage the less amps will be needed to do the same amount of work.
The whole wattage thing is kinda fuzzy. The math is kinda just there so you can see how they get that number. The more watts a motor is rated for the more it can take before overheating. Some hotrodders will drill cooling holes in the sides of their hubs so they can run more amps without over heating the hub.
Each battery has a max amp that it can deliver, and sometimes the manufacture states the amps a battery is rated for on the packaging or in the documents. I’m planning on using a ebike battery with a switch and a key.
From what I’ve seen in the ebike forums It’s always better to run a higher voltage motor for speed, and with as many amps you can handle for all the torque. With out the amps there the motor will bog down under load. This is a electric bike simulator and can give you a idea what you can expect. http://www.electricbikesimulator.com/
This is my first ebike hub motor build, and only my second board build so I’m learning as a go.
Very cool, and I’ll keep reading. Sometimes I read too much and end up knowing less than I did before I started. The point you make about ease of work makes sense though; a car with 100 HP can go 80 mph, but it’ll be working a lot harder than a car with 400. I think the distinction I was making between the bike vs skate ESC was more about that big box with all the wiring for features I don’t need or want; I understand that the basic function of each is a motor controller.
I want the lightest most streamlined setup, and I’m even willing to do some cutting and welding and deck fab if I have to… I have a lot more skills with the mechanical stuff than with the electronics… I’m old(er) so I have a couple decades of bike and car building, welding, basic machining, etc.
I’ve even been thinking about scratch building a Trideck like thing with a tilting deck with a descending element attached to tie rods that would steer the front wheels so I can optimize caster/camber geometry, even a rudimentary suspension. There are lots of cool ideas out there. But for now, the Trideck!
Just finished making a 8ply deck for my trideck. It need a little sanding and sealant. Starting to think I need to make a bumper/skid plate for the front. I’ve got a few ideas on that.
I’ve reached out to a hub motor manufacturer and they on a nice little hub motor that will fit the frame and can hit speeds of 24mph+. It’s rated at 500w, and a tops out at 1000rpm. http://www.peipeiscooter.com